"References to Sources in the Works of J.R.R. Tolkien" by Dawn Felagund (WiP) *AND* A Poll!

[dawn_felagund]

B2MeM Prompt and Path: Compile a List of Sources on a Specific Topic (orange path)
Format: Resource List
Genre: Resource
Rating: General
Warnings: Do not read while driving or operating heavy machinery.
Characters: n/a
Pairings: n/a
Creator's Notes: This is a WiP that may take years to finish. I decided to share it when I reached the midway point of The Silmarillion. Only a dozen-and-a-half more books to go!
Summary: For this prompt, I have decided to begin a project I have wanted to begin for a long time: make a list of every reference to fictional sources or lore or loremasters in Tolkien's works. This is for my own research on historiography and historical bias in the works of J.R.R. Tolkien, but I've opted to make it public so that others interested in this topic can benefit as well from my work.

References to Sources in the Works of J.R.R. Tolkien

The next topic on the orange path is "Meta on Fandom." As some of you know, I ran a survey on Tolkien fan fiction a little over a year ago, and I have all this untouched data just begging to be crunched and written about. Only since this is B2MeM and not the indulgence of my own blog, I'd like to write about something maybe interesting to people reading here? So if you have an opinion on what I should write about, please feel free to choose from the topics below!

ETA: Readers and feedback it is! Thanks, everyone! /ETA

[Poll #2064889]

Comments

[oloriel.livejournal.com]

So many interesting topics, how am I supposed to choose?
Besides the question of whether writing fanfic makes us better writers (I'd say yes, but I'd like to know whether the data agrees - and if it does, this should definitely be an essay that the world outside the fanfic community (TM) needs to read ;)), I'm also really curious about the canon issues - both what we learn through fanfic, and how flexible writers are about adapting their canon to new information (or new fandom trends I guess). So I hope you'll get to tackle more than just the winner from the list. :)

Thank you for sharing your list of source references! I recently stumbled across a list of different in-universe sources (http://www.forodrim.org/gobennas/chron_en.html) (which is internet-ancient, I'm sure you know it already - but some of the lore texts mentioned were completely new to me, bad Lyra!) and chroniclers, which I found very interesting, but your elaborate look at the different mentions in the published Silmarillion itself is even more fascinating. It's so easy to read over these little references to the transmission of lore without really noticing them - I'd never have thought there are so many of them! It's really a lot like the ubiquitous "as ic herde telle" or "as clerkes finden written in their boke" in real-world historical texts (which is exactly the point, I know). So, again, thank you!

[dawn_felagund]

I am definitely going to tackle all of the topics eventually! Probably over the summer while I'm on break. The canon issues interest me immensely (I've done the most so far with looking at data on how users of different sites and archives differ on their willingness to bend canon and in what ways, and that proved much more fruitful and interesting than I expected).

Alas, readers and feedback won, which is fine by me because I've done almost nothing with my reader data. And I know writers always want to know this stuff. :) The lone request I've had for a post about my data has been about writers who don't comment, from a writer, of course. :)

I am familiar with Måns Björkman's page; in fact, it can be seen as having spurred this current project because, when I first found it, when I was first starting my research, I hadn't heard of some of them either. And that made me realize that I really needed to go back through and reread (or sometimes read for the first time, since I haven't read all of the HoMe, even though I own them all) with this particular filter.

It's so easy to read over these little references to the transmission of lore without really noticing them

It is! So much so that, even when reading to look for them, I sometimes catch myself skimming and go back and discover that I've missed one or two.

I'm starting to see patterns in their use and, most of all (most importantly, for my purposes) deliberateness; they are not just embellishments but are used at times when the narrator would have likely lacked a primary source. (Or that's been my observation so far; I'm still in "Of the Ruin of Beleriand.") I don't think I've appreciated the intricacy of Tolkien's work so much as I have since beginning this research and how skillfully he managed truly minute, almost unnoticeable details like this to great effect.

Of course, I think of the formulaic language of Beowulf, being as my thesis was on formulaic language in Beowulf and all! :D

[oloriel.livejournal.com]

The feedback issue is certainly interesting (says a writer who can never get enough of it). The problem is just that there are so many intersting topics on the list. But if you're going to tackle them all, whenever, that's cool. :)

I figured you'd know that page, but I figured that just in case... nothing more frustrating than doing a lot of research and then finding that there's a resource that could've really helped if one had known about it early enough.

That is fantastic. I've been wondering whether I've been reading too much into those references that I did catch. Since the application of the oral-formulaic theory didn't really drift into Anglo-Saxon studies until the 1950s and didn't gather momentum until the late 1960s, by which time Tolkien's academic time was as good as over, I've sort of been afraid that he just threw in a few of these lines because he was using primary-world chronicles as a model, but not putting that much thought into it. So the fact that you're keeping track of the use of these references and observing patterns behind it excites me more than it reasonably should! (Figures that I've been pondering the question, but never bothered to put actual research into it. How low I have fallen!) Now I wonder whether Tolkien kept up with "recent" research or whether he just intuited that stuff!

I've already downloaded your thesis and I'm very much looking forward to reading it. Seems that the oral-formulaic question is still near and dear to my heart. I wish I could go back to college... ;)

[dawn_felagund]

(I want to reply in more detail later--ha! this sounds like the other review thread!--but I need to look at Books and Things re: oral theory ... but I did want to ask: I seem to recall that you offered to read over my UVM presentation when it's ready on historical bias in Tolkien? Is that offer still on the table? 8^) It won't be long; I only have 20 minutes. I haven't even written it yet but would appreciate other smart people to look at it when I do. It's my first all-scholars-no-fandom conference so ...)

[oloriel.livejournal.com]

(Hah! These threads fit together so beautifully, don't they. ;))
That offer is still good, yes! Though I can't pretend to know the preferences of non-fandom scholars but I'll do my very best.